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meanwhile, in washington, there are new revelations of a split within the obama administration about what should be done about the conflict. ray suarez reports. >> suarez: it was a short moment in a long hearing devoted to another topic, and it yielded a surprising set of answers from defense secretary leon panetta, and the joint chiefs chairman, general martin dempsey. arizona republican john mccain asked about a report that president obama rejected a proposal to arm syrian rebels last summer. >> did you support the recommendation by secretary of state... then secretary of state clinton and then head of c.i.a. general petraeus that we provide weapons to the resistance in syria? did you support that? >> we did. >> you did support that. >> we did. >> suarez: so far, the president's judgment has been that things won't get better with american arms. instead, he's warned the weapons might fall into the hands of extremist elements, a concern reiterated today by the new secretary of state, who was asked about the deliberations last year. >> i don't know what the discussions were in the whi
meanwhile, in washington, there are new revelations of a split within the obama administration about what should be done about the conflict. ray suarez reports. >> suarez: it was a short moment in a long hearing devoted to another topic, and it yielded a surprising set of answers from defense secretary leon panetta, and the joint chiefs chairman, general martin dempsey. arizona republican john mccain asked about a report that president obama rejected a proposal to arm syrian rebels last...
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Feb 7, 2013
02/13
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members of congress demanding more details into how the administration justifies the targeted killing of american citizens. the white house says president obama has directed the department of justice to brief members of the intelligence committees. the move comes after five groups of 11 senators led by ron widen of oregon demanded insight into the government's legal rational for drone strikes against americans abroad. senator widen took his frustrations to twitter writing, every american has the right to know when their government believes it is allowed to kill them. very strong words. this, of course, follows a leaked white house memo obtained by nbc news this week detailing the criteria required for such a strike. the white house yesterday found itself under quite a bit of pressure ahead to have day's sthat confirmation hearings for john brennan, of course, nominated to be the next head of the cia. >> why you are dancing around the question of whether or not we kill civilians? why can't the government -- >> i don't think that i'm dancing around it. i didn't dispute it. >> not necess
members of congress demanding more details into how the administration justifies the targeted killing of american citizens. the white house says president obama has directed the department of justice to brief members of the intelligence committees. the move comes after five groups of 11 senators led by ron widen of oregon demanded insight into the government's legal rational for drone strikes against americans abroad. senator widen took his frustrations to twitter writing, every american has...
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Feb 7, 2013
02/13
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legal reasoning for why the administration believes president obama has the power to order the killing of americans in counterterrorism strikes around the world. look at this. ever since anybody knew such a document existed, this is how the administration has been coping with requests to see this document. this is a letter from the justice department telling the aclu that they neither confirm nor deny the existence of the documents described in your request. quote, the fact -- excuse me -- the very fact of the existence or nonexistence of such diagnostics is itself classified. that's what they've been saying for more than a year. but now as of tonight, the administration admitted that that legal reasoning memo exists. the associated press first breaking the news late tonight. nbc news confirming it. the president has directed the justice department to give the memo to the intelligence committees in congress. it is the first time that this will have been seen outside the administration itself. now, the administration has openly in speeches and in public comments asserted that it believe
legal reasoning for why the administration believes president obama has the power to order the killing of americans in counterterrorism strikes around the world. look at this. ever since anybody knew such a document existed, this is how the administration has been coping with requests to see this document. this is a letter from the justice department telling the aclu that they neither confirm nor deny the existence of the documents described in your request. quote, the fact -- excuse me -- the...
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Feb 6, 2013
02/13
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a day ahead of john brennan's confirmation hearing to head the cia, the obama administration's drone program is drawing new scrutiny from both sides of the aisle and raising big questions about just how far the government should go in targeted assassinations without oversight from congress or from the courts. joining me now for our daily fix, msnbc contributor and "usa today" washington bureau chief. chris, first to you, i don't think there is any big question so far as to whether or not john brennan is going to be confirmed at least going into the hearing, but this is a real debate now. because of michael isikoff breaking the story and finding that white paper, and discovering that the justice department had at least september that much to the hill, some members, the 11 senators and at least three the committee asking big questions about why there isn't more oversight. >> what's fascinating is when they announced the trio of nominations, john kerry at state, chuck hagel at defense and john brennan for cia, i remember being on the show and saying i think hagel will be the most contro
a day ahead of john brennan's confirmation hearing to head the cia, the obama administration's drone program is drawing new scrutiny from both sides of the aisle and raising big questions about just how far the government should go in targeted assassinations without oversight from congress or from the courts. joining me now for our daily fix, msnbc contributor and "usa today" washington bureau chief. chris, first to you, i don't think there is any big question so far as to whether or...
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Feb 8, 2013
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joining us now is oregon democratic senator ron wyden, who has repeatedly asked the obama administration bower drone policy. senator wyden, it's good to see you. thank you for being with us. >> thank you for having me again. >> did you not in fact get what you had asked the president to give you and that you thought you would be getting this morning based on your conversation with the president last night? >> rachel, it's not clear. the fact is, and i went in first thing this morning, i was able to read some information that was helpful. i'm just not convinced yet that it is the full legal analysis that we need to do to do vigorous oversight. what today was really about is of course it was a nomination hearing for john brennan. but it ultimately was a question of upholding our system of checks and balances in government. and i think that system is out of whack these days and we've got to do some more for transparency and accountability in getting those checks and balances back. >> in terms of this specific program that you've been asking about the legal advice for, specifically targeting
joining us now is oregon democratic senator ron wyden, who has repeatedly asked the obama administration bower drone policy. senator wyden, it's good to see you. thank you for being with us. >> thank you for having me again. >> did you not in fact get what you had asked the president to give you and that you thought you would be getting this morning based on your conversation with the president last night? >> rachel, it's not clear. the fact is, and i went in first thing this...
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Feb 5, 2013
02/13
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in it, obama administration lawyers argue the government can kill americans believed to be top taliban leaders posing, quote, an imminent threat of attack against the united states. >> we have acknowledged the united states that sometimes we use remotely piloted aircraft to conduct targeted strikes against specific al qaeda terrorists to prevent attacks on the united states and to save american lives. we conduct those strikes because they're necessary to mitigate ongoing actual threats, to stop plots, prevent future attacks and save american lives. the strikes are legal, ethical an wise. >> but as expected, the memo coming under fire from civil rights activists because of how broadly imminent threat is defined. quote, the condition that an operational leader present an imminent threat of violent attack against the united states does not require the united states to have clear evidence that a specific attack on u.s. persons and interests will take place in the immediate future. now, the memo also has new details on legal case behind more drone strikes against al qaeda suspects. such as
in it, obama administration lawyers argue the government can kill americans believed to be top taliban leaders posing, quote, an imminent threat of attack against the united states. >> we have acknowledged the united states that sometimes we use remotely piloted aircraft to conduct targeted strikes against specific al qaeda terrorists to prevent attacks on the united states and to save american lives. we conduct those strikes because they're necessary to mitigate ongoing actual threats,...
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Feb 7, 2013
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administration. whatever the benefit of the drone strikes, they have created enormous recentment among some here in the region who view the strikes as another sign of american arrogance. everywhere i travel from yemen. >> i think they are are not right. they are not right. this is our fight. >> to pakistan. >> you are hitting the dark leadership but the byproduct of this is anger. anger among the people. the innocent people who are getting killed. you are just creating more terrorists. >> now, the man who signs off on the kill list from a basement offense in the white house, john brnan about to be questioned in front of the world. >> i suggest that these targeted strikes against al-qaeda terrorists are, indeed, ethical and just. >> reporter: in pakistan alone there have been more than 300 drone strikes in the last decade, killing thousands of al-qaeda and taliban but more than 300 is civilians as well. a world away in remote villages you you can hear them like a distant muted chain saw. a dull but de
administration. whatever the benefit of the drone strikes, they have created enormous recentment among some here in the region who view the strikes as another sign of american arrogance. everywhere i travel from yemen. >> i think they are are not right. they are not right. this is our fight. >> to pakistan. >> you are hitting the dark leadership but the byproduct of this is anger. anger among the people. the innocent people who are getting killed. you are just creating more...
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many, many more attacks under the obama administration, 360 so far, and probably just the president's first term, though, no doubt there have been some since he was knock raided for the second, xarpd to 50 in the bush 43 administration. so john brennan was pressed since the new rules on the use of drones finally came out secretly, given to members of the senate intelligence committee overnight, a promise by the administration there will be care taken to maintain american values, maybe even a court setup to review drone strikes before they're launched. here's john brennan. >> the president has insisted that any actions we take will be legally grounded, will be thoroughly anchored in intelligence, will have the appropriate review process, approval process before any action is contemplated, includes those access that might involve the use of lethal force. brennan is a sure bet to win confirmation. here's an irony. it looks lie he may get less trouble from republicans, this obama appointee, than from some liberal democrats like ron wyden of oregon, who just cannot swallow the idea that a
many, many more attacks under the obama administration, 360 so far, and probably just the president's first term, though, no doubt there have been some since he was knock raided for the second, xarpd to 50 in the bush 43 administration. so john brennan was pressed since the new rules on the use of drones finally came out secretly, given to members of the senate intelligence committee overnight, a promise by the administration there will be care taken to maintain american values, maybe even a...
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Feb 8, 2013
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he said it was a good first step in terms of moving toward more transparency from the obama administration regarding the drone program. you agree with that assessment? was it enough or is more needed to be done? >> well, i think obviously it's a very important issue we have to it continue to discuss, and i wanted to start with the idea that yesterday's hearing was pretty remarkable. it's a great country that can have an issue of that delicacy with lots of different points of view aired in public with senators of different points of view asking questions. i thought john brennan did a good job. he was very straightforward. i got the feeling he was giving us the answers that were what he really thought and believed. he wasn't playing games with words so, yeah, i think there's going to be a lot of work. i mean, this is a new technique of warfare. and it's something that we have to try to figure out how do we do it judiciously? the other thing we have to think about is we're not going to be the only people on the planet that have this technology indefinitely and what we're doing now, in a sense
he said it was a good first step in terms of moving toward more transparency from the obama administration regarding the drone program. you agree with that assessment? was it enough or is more needed to be done? >> well, i think obviously it's a very important issue we have to it continue to discuss, and i wanted to start with the idea that yesterday's hearing was pretty remarkable. it's a great country that can have an issue of that delicacy with lots of different points of view aired in...
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Feb 10, 2013
02/13
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administration, gates, hagel, lahood. we're trying to do the right thing -- >> we're out of time. anybody think he's not going to get confirmed? >> he's going to get confirmed absolutely. >> great roundtable. stephanie will stick around and answer your facebook questions on the web exclusive and george saunders getting attention over his new book "tenth of december." he joins us next. tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 seems like etfs are everywhere these days. tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 but there is one source with a wealth of etf knowledge tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 all in one place. tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 introducing schwab etf onesource™. tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 it's one source with the most commission-free etfs. tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 one source with etfs from leading providers tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 and extensive coverage of major asset classes... tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 all brought to you by one firm tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 with comprehensive education, tools and personal guidance tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 to help you find etfs that may
administration, gates, hagel, lahood. we're trying to do the right thing -- >> we're out of time. anybody think he's not going to get confirmed? >> he's going to get confirmed absolutely. >> great roundtable. stephanie will stick around and answer your facebook questions on the web exclusive and george saunders getting attention over his new book "tenth of december." he joins us next. tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 seems like etfs are everywhere these days. tdd#:...
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Feb 5, 2013
02/13
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and you look at this memo, which is an obama administration memo. first of all, you read it in its entirety. people can go on dotcom. it's really hard to see anything there that's -- that relates to operational security. it's not classified. it's purely legal arguments. so why has it taken until now for us to get a copy of it and let the public read it? >> we know for sure the memo was written by the justice department. we assume inside the olc, the office of legal counsel. that's what we believe. >> the sequence of events, as i understand them is this. members of congress, pat leahy, others, were demanding to see the olc memos on targeted killing of americans. >> jane harman who was in the house intelligence committee saying she was stunned more hadn't been demanding this. say they'd asked during the bush years for olc memos. >> democrats were not nearly as loud on this subject as they were during the bush years, but they were asking for them. and so what the justice department did was say, okay, we're not going to give you the olc memos because we
and you look at this memo, which is an obama administration memo. first of all, you read it in its entirety. people can go on dotcom. it's really hard to see anything there that's -- that relates to operational security. it's not classified. it's purely legal arguments. so why has it taken until now for us to get a copy of it and let the public read it? >> we know for sure the memo was written by the justice department. we assume inside the olc, the office of legal counsel. that's what we...
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Feb 10, 2013
02/13
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i think the rules and practices that the obama administration has followed are -- are quite stringent and are not being abused. but who is to say about a future president? and so i think -- i think this idea of being able to execute in effect an american citizen, no matter how awful, having some third party being -- having a say in it or perhaps some informing the congress or the -- intelligence committees or something like that, i just -- i think some check on the ability of a president to do this has merit as we look to the longer-term future. >> when it became known that the bush administration was using enhanced interrogation techniques on certain folks that had been captured, the outrage was immediate. and yet we have the u.s. targeting an american -- an american citizen and killing an american citizen and we see that the use of drones widely approve by the american people and there hasn't been much until recently out of congress. why do you -- how do you account in the difference in the reaction? are they entirely separate? is that a curious thing? >> how about politics? >> i'll
i think the rules and practices that the obama administration has followed are -- are quite stringent and are not being abused. but who is to say about a future president? and so i think -- i think this idea of being able to execute in effect an american citizen, no matter how awful, having some third party being -- having a say in it or perhaps some informing the congress or the -- intelligence committees or something like that, i just -- i think some check on the ability of a president to do...
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Feb 10, 2013
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the obama administration quite austen tash shusly presented it. even after the troops come home from afghan starngs we will still be a nation of wafrmt in 1832, carl wrote war is an act of force. it's freely operating and obedient to no law but their own. much in the last century, particularly after the horror of the second war was an attempt to prove clausewitz was wrong. i say we choose the lauchlt we'll sew you right after this. twins. i didn't see them coming. i have obligations. cute obligations, but obligations. i need to rethink the core of my portfolio. what i really need is sleep. introducing the ishares core, building blocks for the heart of your portfolio. find out why 9 out of 10 large professional investors choose ishares for their etfs. ishares by blackrock. call 1-800-ishares for a prospectus which includes investment objectives, risks, charges and expenses. read and consider it carefully before investing. risk includes possible loss of principal. when the doctor told me that i could smoke for the first week... i'm like...yeah, ok..
the obama administration quite austen tash shusly presented it. even after the troops come home from afghan starngs we will still be a nation of wafrmt in 1832, carl wrote war is an act of force. it's freely operating and obedient to no law but their own. much in the last century, particularly after the horror of the second war was an attempt to prove clausewitz was wrong. i say we choose the lauchlt we'll sew you right after this. twins. i didn't see them coming. i have obligations. cute...
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Feb 8, 2013
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CNBC
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the obama administration has not been forthcoming. they have been missing in action when it mattered, they have been misleading people. >> sorry, out of time. ann coulter, great, thank you very much. mark and peter, much more time the next time. that's it for tonight's show. i'm larry kudlow. thanks for watching. she knows you like no one else. and you wouldn't have it any other way. but your erectile dysfunction - you know, that could be a question of blood flow. cialis tadalafil for daily use helps you be ready anytime the moment's right. you can be more confident in your ability to be ready. and the same cialis is the only daily ed tablet approved to treat ed and symptoms of bph, like needing to go frequently or urgently. tell your doctor about all your medical conditions and medications, and ask if your heart is healthy enough for sexual activity. do not take cialis if you take nitrates for chest pain, as this may cause an unsafe drop in blood pressure. do not drink alcohol in excess with cialis. side effects may include headache,
the obama administration has not been forthcoming. they have been missing in action when it mattered, they have been misleading people. >> sorry, out of time. ann coulter, great, thank you very much. mark and peter, much more time the next time. that's it for tonight's show. i'm larry kudlow. thanks for watching. she knows you like no one else. and you wouldn't have it any other way. but your erectile dysfunction - you know, that could be a question of blood flow. cialis tadalafil for...
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Feb 7, 2013
02/13
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FOXNEWS
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a new discussion with the obama administration wanting to bring gitmo to new york and give them trials where they have lawyers, rights to appeal. cross examination, decided by a jury and yet here under this government program, a high government official, i don't know who that is. judge, jury, executioner of americans. >> again, i have concerns about the hypocrisy. >> greta: forget the hypocrisy. do you have any trouble with that? >> again, i have to say it's depending on the circumstances. my feeling is that in certain circumstances, that option should be available to a president, but it should be very good intelligence and as high threshold of standards, that has to be in a country where-- >> yemen would be out to you. >> based on the circumstances it would be a higher threshold. i think as i said earlier it would not necessarily be out, but other countries where we have relations where we do work with the government not doing drones-- >> and do you think you'll be running for president. >> we'll be talking and we're certainly open to looking at 2016. >> greta: it's definitely not a n
a new discussion with the obama administration wanting to bring gitmo to new york and give them trials where they have lawyers, rights to appeal. cross examination, decided by a jury and yet here under this government program, a high government official, i don't know who that is. judge, jury, executioner of americans. >> again, i have concerns about the hypocrisy. >> greta: forget the hypocrisy. do you have any trouble with that? >> again, i have to say it's depending on the...
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Feb 7, 2013
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>> well, there was an interesting statistic in the first year of the obama administration. i think -- or perhaps over the first couple of years in the administration. he authorized more drone strikes and more people were killed in drone strikes that he authorized than the total number of people that had before passed through guantanamo bay. that crystallizes that hypocrisy people talk about. >> you could also argue that we know drone strikes work. you know, the jury still seems like it's out with regard to hash shall interrogation metz thod but drone strikes work. >> in terms of the morality, you know, if you determine that there are threats out there, there are bad guys that you need to take off the battlefield but you can't go there, you can't go to pakistan, you can't go to certain places, then what alternative do you have if you can't capture them. nornd, once you have detained suspected terrorists, there are all sorts of international laws, the laws of war, the geneva conventions that say you can't touch the person, you can't, you know, punch the person in the nose let
>> well, there was an interesting statistic in the first year of the obama administration. i think -- or perhaps over the first couple of years in the administration. he authorized more drone strikes and more people were killed in drone strikes that he authorized than the total number of people that had before passed through guantanamo bay. that crystallizes that hypocrisy people talk about. >> you could also argue that we know drone strikes work. you know, the jury still seems like...
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Feb 6, 2013
02/13
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obama has protected 2.6 million acres which is less than ronald reagan, george h.w. bush, bill clinton and george w. bush. interesting these picks. we'll nominate brennan and we'll nominate sally jewell and whether there's actually going to be a substantive discussion about energy, climate issues and also national security policy remains to be d. on that very thoughtful note, i will leave the program. thank you to rick, john, maggie and hugo and don't forget to pick up john's book, thomas jefferson, the art of power. that's all for now. i'll see you back here tomorrow at noon eastern 9:00 a.m. pacific when i'm joined by sam stein, michael haney and the aclu. you can find us on facebook. andrea mitchell reports is coming up next. tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 when i'm trading, i'm totally focused. tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 and the streetsmart edge trading platform from charles schwab... tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 gives me tools that help me find opportunities more easily. tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 i can even access it from the cloud and trade on any computer. tdd#: 1-800-
obama has protected 2.6 million acres which is less than ronald reagan, george h.w. bush, bill clinton and george w. bush. interesting these picks. we'll nominate brennan and we'll nominate sally jewell and whether there's actually going to be a substantive discussion about energy, climate issues and also national security policy remains to be d. on that very thoughtful note, i will leave the program. thank you to rick, john, maggie and hugo and don't forget to pick up john's book, thomas...
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than those produced by the obama administration? >> i do not think there was a different standard. >> one was released within four months of the obama administration taking office. the other had been requested for a much longer time. >> i am not a lawyer. i have come to learn of the term sui generis. the olc memos released after the president came into office were released because the program was terminated. olc will counsel opinions, and those opinions were looked at in a different way because of the sui generis circumstances. >> both are essential for the ability of congress to carry its oversight responsibilities. finally, the intelligence reform act and terrorist prevention act of 2004, with which you are very familiar and which i was a co-author, requires the director of national intelligence to recommend who the cia director should be to the president of the united states. i am aware of general clapper -- the dni's letter, endorsing your nomination, which is different from his actually recommending to the president that you be
than those produced by the obama administration? >> i do not think there was a different standard. >> one was released within four months of the obama administration taking office. the other had been requested for a much longer time. >> i am not a lawyer. i have come to learn of the term sui generis. the olc memos released after the president came into office were released because the program was terminated. olc will counsel opinions, and those opinions were looked at in a...
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Feb 7, 2013
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>> well, this obama administration between president obama, joe biden, secretary of state john kerry, potential secretary of defense chuck hagel i would argue, is the most pro iran engagement u.s. national security cabinet since the 1979 revolution. this is an administration which desperately does want to do a deal with iran to diffuse the nuclear issue and to gradually reduce our footprint in the middle east. they certainly don't want to the go to war. and i'm not sure if ayatollah khamenei understands this is going to be the best deal he's going to get from the united states. >> suarez:. >> brown: well, the demands for the u.s. and others seems fairly clear and the push for sanctions go on. the iranians say they want the sanctions lifted first. so have you heard anything that suggests it's a sort of vicious cycle in that regard? >> this has also been a perennial challenge that synchronizing negotiations, who makes the first overture, but it's not within the realm of possibilities that the u.s. congress or president obama is going to remove sanctions before the negotiations start and
>> well, this obama administration between president obama, joe biden, secretary of state john kerry, potential secretary of defense chuck hagel i would argue, is the most pro iran engagement u.s. national security cabinet since the 1979 revolution. this is an administration which desperately does want to do a deal with iran to diffuse the nuclear issue and to gradually reduce our footprint in the middle east. they certainly don't want to the go to war. and i'm not sure if ayatollah...
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Feb 6, 2013
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the same is true of the obama stad ad administration more generally -- obama administration more generally. for the past four years the executive branch has gone to extraordinary lengths to obscure the danger posed by those who practice holy war or jihad against our country. the administration has also sought to silence and in some cases punish those who have spoken the trute about this menace. -- the truth about this menace. mr. speaker, i welcome the secretary's warning, belater though it may be. however, it would have served this country and the cause of freedom far more if she would have so openly and to have led encountering it at any point during her tenure other than its conclusion. one of the most important architects of that see no jihad policy over the past four years has been john brennan, president obama's homeland security advisor and his pick to become the next director of the central intelligence agency. in may, 2010, mr. brennan publicly declared that we do not describe our enemy as jihadists or islamists because jihad is a holy struggle, a legitimate tenant of islam, meani
the same is true of the obama stad ad administration more generally -- obama administration more generally. for the past four years the executive branch has gone to extraordinary lengths to obscure the danger posed by those who practice holy war or jihad against our country. the administration has also sought to silence and in some cases punish those who have spoken the trute about this menace. -- the truth about this menace. mr. speaker, i welcome the secretary's warning, belater though it may...
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Feb 6, 2013
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. >> alisyn: first term scandals could be coming back to haunt the obama administration as a columnist suggests some high profile leaks could amount to an inpeachable offense. that high. we'll look at legal arguments from both sides. 24 hours after the obama administration had given authorities to kill americans with drones, we're asking why there's not more outrage in the media and capitol hill. hollywood speaks out defending the second amendment. here is a hint who it is. [ male announcer ] truth is, dayquil doesn't treat that. really? [ male announcer ] alka-seltzer plus fights your worst cold symptoms, plus it relieves your runny nose. [ breathes deeply ] awesome. [ male announcer ] yes, it is. that's the cold truth! i have obligations. cute tobligations, but obligations.g. i need to rethink the core of my portfolio. what i really need is sleep. introducing the ishares core, building blocks for the heart of your portfolio. find out why 9 out of 10 large professional investors choose ishares for their etfs. ishares by blackrock. call 1-800-ishares for a prospectus which includes inv
. >> alisyn: first term scandals could be coming back to haunt the obama administration as a columnist suggests some high profile leaks could amount to an inpeachable offense. that high. we'll look at legal arguments from both sides. 24 hours after the obama administration had given authorities to kill americans with drones, we're asking why there's not more outrage in the media and capitol hill. hollywood speaks out defending the second amendment. here is a hint who it is. [ male...
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Feb 9, 2013
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bush and any way to adjudicate the possibilities of what war means to the obama administration? >> well, i think that, i think that is absolutely right, it has been a continuation of the bush administration policies, and yes, administrations always try to push the outer bounds of the authority. but one thank is clear is that the laws of war have not changed even if the practice has changed. there are really three reasons that a country can, a state can use force outside of its borders. one, if it is the victim of an armed attack and second if the u.n. security council authorizes it, and three, assisting a state that requests it, and we have stretched that boundary as well far beyond what the laws of war call for. so i think that there is a very serious question about this question of perpetual war, but we should remember historically in the 20th century, the u.s. was at war virtually every decade of the 20th century, so if we think of ourselves as peaceful country that does not engage in war, we need to rethink that. >> that is right. david, i want to ask this question, because
bush and any way to adjudicate the possibilities of what war means to the obama administration? >> well, i think that, i think that is absolutely right, it has been a continuation of the bush administration policies, and yes, administrations always try to push the outer bounds of the authority. but one thank is clear is that the laws of war have not changed even if the practice has changed. there are really three reasons that a country can, a state can use force outside of its borders....
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it's an administration that there's been plenty of grumbling about that president obama has not spent muff time courting them, that he doesn't care about them. he was very briefly a member of congress and it's not a priority. i think some of that just goes with the territory. that theenz democrats too as well as republicans. >> chris, kelly, thank you both very much. >>> immigration reform, joining me now, one of the lawmakers who took part in today's congressional hearings, the house hearings on immigration policy. ru ease gutierrez, thank you very much. this was sort of the opening act on the house side. we've seen a big shift on republicans -- in republicans and a lot of action coming from the senate. what are you seeing on the house side? >> well, here's what i'm seeing on the house side. here we have the judiciary committee, and it's first hearing on the full committee. what are we discussing? immigration. some would say, well, the kind of focussing on the high skilled industry and the need for more. that's good. i support more visas. part of comprehensive immigration reform is m
it's an administration that there's been plenty of grumbling about that president obama has not spent muff time courting them, that he doesn't care about them. he was very briefly a member of congress and it's not a priority. i think some of that just goes with the territory. that theenz democrats too as well as republicans. >> chris, kelly, thank you both very much. >>> immigration reform, joining me now, one of the lawmakers who took part in today's congressional hearings, the...